Bug with Layers & Groups (2010)

[Jennifer]

Start with a new Visio document. Mine is General, Basic, US Units, but I doubt that matters.

• Create 2 layers: Layer 1 & Layer 2. Make them both visible.
• Place 3 objects: Square, circle, triangle.
• Assign two of them (square & triangle) to Layer 1.
• Select all 3 and make a group.
• Assign the group to Layer 2.
• Make Layer 2 invisible.

The square & triangle will be visible, but not selectable.

I've attached a document with this condition.

[wapperdude]

That behavior is repeatable in V2007.

Wapperdude

[Jennifer]

Well, I guess that's both good and bad news. The good news is that at least M$FT didn't make Visio 2010 any worse that 2007 (at least based on this bug). The bad news is that they don't appear that serious about fixing even obvious bugs. (sigh)

[Jennifer]

I just discovered that this bug is even worse than I thought. The "cure" for the phantom objects in Layer1 is:

• Make Layer2 visible.
• Select each object in the group, individually or collectively. Remove them from Layer1. (Select the {Multiple Layers} option.)
• Unselect the group. This is a security precaution. If left selected, it will still be visible when Layer2 is first made invisible. Any changes, such as an accidental Delete key, will be applied.
• Make Layer2 invisible.
• If the (apparently empty) group is still selected, press Esc to clear it.

So there are actually two bugs. The second is leaving an object selected when the layer it is assigned to is made invisible.

[Nikolay]

Hi Jennifer, I think you may have "Preserve group member layers" checkbox set (see the screenshot)

In Visio, sub-shapes in a group can be on layers, different from the group's layer.
This is a feature; probably this is what you see, as far as I can tell - the Square and Triangle were left on Layer1 (visible) when you assigned their group shape Layer2.
The checkbox I mentioned controls this; if you want the layer for all group members also be changed when you change layer for a group, you should not set it.

[Jennifer]

Hi Jennifer, I think you may have "Preserve group member layers" checkbox set (see the screenshot)

I wasn't aware of that setting. I assign objects to layers using an icon on the Quick Access Toolbar, so I never see that dialog.

I have now checked that setting. It is not set as far as I can tell.

In Visio, sub-shapes in a group can be on layers, different from the group's layer.
This is a feature; probably this is what you see, as far as I can tell - the Square and Triangle were left on Layer1 (visible) when you assigned their group shape Layer2.

I attached the file to my original post. Did you look at it to see if that setting was on or off?

The checkbox I mentioned controls this; if you want the layer for all group members also be changed when you change layer for a group, you should not set it.

I'm not so sure. To test your claim, I created 2 new files. In both, I replicated the procedure from my original post. In #1, I made sure that that setting was not checked. In the other, I made sure that it was, The results are the same.

So, I resubmit my bug report. Someone at M$FT forgot to implement that setting and that has been true for at least 2 releases.

[Nikolay]

I've checked the drawing from the last post. For me, the file look like this (see the screenshot)..

I have highlighted everything that is on layer 2 with gray, everything that is on layer 1 is white.
Shape "A" (Square) on your drawing is both on Layer1 and Layer2 - that's why it does not disappear when you hide Layer2.

What happens now when you make Layer2 invisible? All shapes which are only on Layer2 become invisible.
So on the shapes which exist not only on Layer2, but also on Layer1 are left on the page.

This is just to clarify what's going on here.