Control of layers (Bring to Front / Send back) Floor Plan

[JohnP]

My first use of Visio requires me to show routes through a building. I am having difficulties in keeping the route arrows on top of the door opening. If I make changes the door seems to move on top of the arrow. Is there a way (2003) that I can ensure the order of layers or symbols?

[vojo]

use layers (view==>layers)...I dont recall if its implicit ordering (first one always on top) or explicit ordering (by some number).

[Paul Herber]

What appears to be happening is that many changes to the drawing cause
the Plan addon to change the Z-order of many of the shapes, in
particular shapes not normally associated with plans, like the arrow
shapes used by John.
Hmmm.

[JohnP]

Paul - thanks for clarifying my problem (I had sent him an example)

I had imported some arrows from Powerpoint for use in Visio. I wanted a style which wasn't readily found in Visio. I want an arrow head which retains its angles when stretched or broadened. Many seem to change proportionally. I am required to match some work done on an old CadVance system.

Please offer suggestions as to the cause or better still, the solution. Ideally I want to fix a layer of arrows to always be above the doors.

[vojo]

you are better off making your own shapes vs using PPT shapes...If you are doing anything serious, take
the time to make your shapes...work savings later will become obvious.

powerpoint is like a big fat charcoal pencil
(fixed coarse format/offsets/guides/resolution - try nudging a shape and notice you cant nudge it "half way", no visibility to shape source code, and cannot make/use sophisticated shapes per se,  etc..
...of course, PPT has a richer animation scheme)

visio is like a precision mechanical pencil
(settable fine format/offsets/guides/resolution...location settable to 0.0001 mm, shape source visible and can craft sophisticated shapes, etc...of course not everybody has visio or even understands why its around).

Once done, copy back into powerpoint or word so that you can share with others if need be

[Visio Guy]

"powerpoint is like a big fat charcoal pencil"

This is super-hilarious if you don't read the whole post and just take it out of context!

[Visio Guy]

Ok, now that I've read everything:

• PowerPoint got the idea for "smart arrows" from Visio (ME and a few other then-interns in 1992)
• Therefore, Visio has arrows that maintain their head-proportions when stretched.
• You'll find these arrows under File > Shapes > General > Basic Shapes
• The Space Plan stuff does do some z-re-ordering. One example is to put door openings on top of walls (and obscure the walls with a white blotch)
• Layers don't really have anything to do with z-order. This is a CAD concept that Visio doesn't share.
• Shapes can belong to multiple layers, so this would really mess up the z-ordering of layers anyway.

Have a look at the smart arrows in action:

[JohnP]

I haven't got:

File > Shapes > General > Basic Shapes

No "General"

OP

[JohnP]

Sorry - found it under "Block Diagram" Basic Shapes.

I am using the 45 degree arrows.

[JohnP]

I have tried using a 45 degree arrow from the basic shapes. If I put the arrow through a door then if I move the borders of the drawing or make any change to the wall, then the arrow goes behind the door.

Getting desperate!

[Paul Herber]

I have a fix that will work at least temporarily, it'll allow you to modify and print your diagram.
Close Visio
In Windows Explorer find the folder where Visio is installed, probably C:\program files\microsoft office\Visioxx\   where xx is probably 11
Now find the DLL folder, in there will be a file called AEC.DLL
This is the appropriate add-on file, rename it to 1AEC.DLL
Now open your diagram, it will say installing Visio, press cancel, the layout will not now be messed around.
But, other things may not work, remember close Visio and restore the name back to AEC.DLL afterwards.

[JohnP]

If "Space Plan" can always put a door on top of a wall, then why can't I always have an arrow on top a door?

Sorry - I am a simple user looking for an easy fix. Surely there are other examples where users want to preserve a z-order.

[Paul Herber]

Right, it's some setting in the user-defined cells, I've just copied all the user-defined cells from the door shape to one of the arrows using my Utilities. Now, the z-order is more stable. Moving the door, then repositioning still changes the z-order but other things work.
I'll leave it for someone in the part of the world where it might still be daytime to continue with this as it's now midnight here.

[wapperdude]

I took a look at the User-defined section, nothing jumped out at me.  It could be buried in code and not visible in the shapesheet.  Something similar to the whole org chart phenomena.  But, this might be a simple work-around, and you've probably done most of it already.  Create a layer, call it arrows.  Assign all your arrows to that layer (you know, putting all your arrows in one quiver  ).  Do all your edits for the session, let the arrows fall where they will (pun intended).     When you're done editting, then go to Edit > Select by Type, and select your arrow layer.  Cntl-Shift-F will bring all arrows to the top.

HTH
Wapperdude.

[JohnP]

Thanks Wapperdude. Unfortunately, my arrows need to be specific to each room as they are on a printable layer with a "You are here" and a route to a fire exit.

Alterations to the wall, make the arrow go behind the wall and door. Is there an alternative way of looking at the issue and making the wall / door layer always be at the back? (even if nudged)